Violent protests erupted Friday in a busy market area of
Lhasa, the Tibetan capital, as Buddhist monks and other ethnic Tibetans
clashed with Chinese security forces. The protesters burned shops,
cars, military vehicles and at least one tourist bus, according to
witnesses.The demonstrations were the most violent since protests by Buddhist
monks began in Lhasa on Monday, the anniversary of a failed Tibetan
uprising against Chinese rule in 1959. The protests have been the
largest in Tibet since the late 1980s, when Chinese security forces
repeatedly used lethal force to restore order in the region.The developments prompted the Dalai Lama,
the exiled spiritual leader of Tibetan Buddhism, to issue a statement
saying he was concerned about the situation and appealing to the
Chinese leadership to “stop using force and address the long-simmering
resentment of the Tibetan people”.
Hard to know what is going on or how far it will go. Reports of people killed are disheartening. At this point I can only hope that Chinese authorities do not move to lethal force as an early option in crowd control. Along these lines, Confucius would agree with the Dali Lama:
Asking Confucius about governing, Lord Chi K’ang said: "What if I secure those who abide in the Way by killing those who ignore Way – will that work?"
"How can you govern by killing?" replied Confucius. "Just set your heart on what is virtuous and benevolent, and the people will be virtuous and benevolent. The noble-minded have the Integrity of wind, and the little people the Integrity of grass. When the wind sweeps over the grass, it bends." (12.19)
Mencius would concur:
Mencius said: "To pretend force is Humanity – that’s the mark of a tyrant, and a tyrant needs a large country. To practice Humanity through Integrity – that’s the mark of a true emperor, and a true emperor doesn’t need a large country. T’ang began with only seventy square miles, and Emperor Wen began with only a hundred square miles. If you use force to gain the people’s submission, it isn’t a submission of the heart. It’s only a submission of the weak to the strong. But if you use Integrity to gain the people’s submission, it’s a submission of the sincere and delighted heart….(3.3)
The Useless Tree 
26 responses to “Tibet”
your intention is very kind,but I’m afraid it’s no use.
till now,violence is still the only source of legitimacy of CCP’s governing, and the great sayings of Confucius & Mencius(and yours) are just to ‘whistle jigs to a milestone'(对牛弹琴)!
and do you know? suppressing riots with heavy violence in tibet in 1989 was one of Hu jintao’s main achivements which Deng xiaoping appreciated and selected him to be the future crown prince then.
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A U.S. documentary on CIA’s secret war in Tibet might shed some light on ANY discussion on Tibet and Dalai Lama …
http://www.youtube.com/results?search_query=CIA+tibet&search_type=
http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&q=CIA+Tibet&btnG=Google+Search
Let me know and enlight me if you find all these are from Chinese propaganda and misinformation …
Isha
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This one is definitely Chinese government’s misinformation campaign…
Six weeks after he left Tibet, with the governments’ official written request for covert military aid in hand, that document was encrypted and transmitted back to Washington where it landed on the desk of Dean Rusk, at the State Department. Weeks later the CIA began to air drop small amounts of military aid into Tibet. Weeks after that China invaded, claiming it did so to halt ‘Imperialist Plots’. America publicly denied any covert US involvement as ‘Communist Propaganda’. Tibet had to lie about these events, to protect America.
http://www.intotibet.info/aboutthebook.html
Should one be surprised if 50 years from now, some future historian uncovered some truth about what is going on right now in Tibet? Or you would rather rely upon the versions of truth from the CNN, Fox News, BBC, and VOA…
IshA
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Do you truly believe that this is an American plot? Does the CCP bear no responsibility for conditions in Tibet?
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For the first question: “Should one be surprised if 50 years from now, some future historian uncovered some truth about what is going on right now in Tibet? “…
For the second question: For course, CCP is responsible for what is happening in Tibet, because CCP is in charge of China and Tibet is part of China. But the question is: for what?
… CCP is responsible for neglience from protection the safety and property of Chinese citizens, whatever their identity. According to the reports, most of the deaths are from the shop owners and workers in these shops. By its relecutancy to enforce Chinese law toward these burning, murdering, smashing criminals, CCP is partily responsible for their deaths.
2008 Olympics is a very silly idea, international anti-China groups are utilize this opportunity to blackmail China to its full potential. The biggest issue is still Taiwan, Xingjing and Tibet are just smokescreen and it is expected.
Isha
P.S.
Now:
How more nonviolent this could be …女人被当街殴打,商店店主被杀,商店被暴徒抢劫纵火
Then:
“”We only lived to kill Chinese,” recalled one Tibetan veteran. “Our hopes were high.” One of the trainees, Gyato Wangdu (who would later become the last commander of the Chushi Gandrug), asked CIA operations officer Roger McCarthy for “a portable nuclear weapon of some kind…that the trainees might employ to destroy Chinese by the hundreds.” The CIA declined, but McCarthy noted that Wangdu “did take to demolition training with renewed enthusiasm” and became quite taken with bazookas and mortars.
”
The relevency of Mao:
[editor’s note: long Mao passage deleted]
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I see no need for Mao’s words here, so I have taken them down. You can link to them if you like, but they take up too much space and distract from the main themes of this blog.
It is sad that you cannot seem to see beyond the narrowest nationalist-chauvinist apologies. Mao is a genius! The Party cannot err! Tibetans and Uighurs and Taiwanese and Chinese like Nick (above comment), who dare question the state’s propaganda, and Cai Guo-Qiang and Americans and Europeans and the UN High Commissioner and on and on and on must all be wrong. It is all a CIA plot to weaken and embarrass China…. Why don’t we throw Lei Feng into the mix for good measure. I’m sure he, too, would be rushing to Lhasa to do his bit.
I’ll stick with Mencius and Confucius and Chuang Tzu and the wise and beautiful creations of Chinese civilization. You can have Mao and Qin and the untold numbers of Chinese people they killed.
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The fact is very clear on who is doing the killing, smashing and burning in Tibet now. It is unknown who is organizing it… even though history do give us some clue…If pointing out these facts is my “the narrowest nationalist-chauvinist apologies”, so be it…
If such things happen in L.A., what is your advice to Mr. Bush?
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I wonder if it might have something to do with the attempt (whether intentional or not) to slowly smother the indigenous Tibetan population through a constant influx of Han Chinese? Eventually, the culture disappears as the Chinese play more and more of a prominent role in Lhasa and the surrounding area. Maybe they feel a wee-bit threatened? I’m sure there are many more reasons, but that one seems a bit obvious.
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Sirs: Please take a minute to view this youtube presentation, after that I have nothing to say about Tibet:
http://washeng.net/HuaShan/BBS/shishi/gbcurrent/158542.shtml
What cann’t break China will make China stronger. Thank you.
Isha
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Isha,
I’m sorry, but I can’t help but to note the irony of paraphrasing Nietzsche in order to support Chinese Tibetan policy. This is the guy who felt strongly (I’m ignoring the crappy readings of Nietzsche that support a Nazi-Borg philosophy of overwhelming other cultures) that one’s strength is measured by the amount of difference one could incorporate into one’s own world-view (or culture) while remaining harmonious (to use a Chinese term).
If it is true that the Chinese (unofficial) policy is to slowly strangle out Tibetan culture, then from a Nietzschean point of view this would be nothing more than a sign of intense weakness.
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CP,
I planned not to write anything about Tibet, but I consider it as bad taste not to response to your thoughtful note.
1.
I am glad you haven’t brush Nietzschean out as a parish in the polite society but I didn’t even realize I was parapharing him when I was writing the last note ( I did, indeed, quoted him ). But anyway, I liked Nietzschean concept of strength and beauty coming from conflicts ( inherented differences ) and its harmonization, such as the Greek architectures he mentioned.
2. Using Nietzschean concept, China is still in the process of defining the concept of ” Chinese ” even in the crisis of its existential challenges. Chinese cultures is definitely not only ” Han” culture, even the concept of ” Han” is a man made concept, since, to be frank, PRC is somehow a inherited the legacy of Ching empire. Tibetan culture has a part in shaping and reshaping of the Chinese culture.
3.
Unfortuately for 14th Dalai Lama, he made a bad choice in the 50s by listening to his older brother and cooperated with CIA’s secret warfare against the advices of Zhou enli. He could have worked with Beijing and bargain a better deal for the Tibetians and his Tibetian ruling class. Later on, by offering himself as a asset for CIA and Hollywood, he forever lost his relevance in positively influencing the reshaping Chinese identity vie Tibetan buddaism. Of course, the Tibetian people and its culture are still active in China. Now the Chinese policy is to follow the advice of Henry IV, ” in that barren mountain ( the wildness and spirtual barrenness of Hollywood and western materialism ) let him die…” … he took the bite, one he had to take the whole hook… But I understand that Tibetian culture is stronger than Dalai 14th’s physical wellbeing.
3. “If it is true that the Chinese (unofficial) policy is to slowly strangle out Tibetan culture, then from a Nietzschean point of view this would be nothing more than a sign of intense weakness.”
In the if clasue, you have already gave your verdict and showed your position , the youtube presentation is the best response.
4.
The coordination of this incident in the three provinces within China and general global coordination all over the world is actually helping Chinese government by rallying the public opinion within China for the coming storms that are surely on the horizon ( global finanical meltdown, inflation, Taiwan independence, etc, etc…)
Respectfully,
Isha
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I do not trust any Chinese discourse on Tibet issue, they are all under suspicion for their brainwashed “the narrowest nationalist-chauvinist apologies”. I am only quoting respectable Western eyewitnesses such as
1.
An Canadian eyewitness who is currently in Lasha:
http://kadfly.blogspot.com/search?q=Lhasa
Lhasa Burning
The situation has gotten much worse… Maybe 100 meters further there was a massive crowd of Tibetans surrounding a narrow alleyway. As it turned out, they were throwing stones and abuse at PLA soldiers who were blockading the passage to a monastery. After a minute or two, everyone rushed the PLA blockade and burst through. The soldiers left parts of their riot gear lying around and Tibetans started breaking them.
… Shops were taken apart, buses filled with passengers were attacked, motorcyclists were stoned. We fled into the relative safety of a nearby hotel as attention began to be drawn to us and from there we saw the street and nearby stores get ripped apart and more violence. Before being ushered into a safer part of the hotel away from the street we also saw a monk (or at least someone dressed like one) direct an attack on a store or restaurant with a small Chinese flag flying from it.
…
I want to make one thing clear because all of the major news outlets are ignoring a very important fact. Yes, the Chinese government bears a huge amount of blame for this situation. But the protests yesterday were NOT peaceful. The original protests from the past few days may have been, but all of the eyewitnesses in this room agree the protesters yesterday went from attacking Chinese police to attacking innocent people very, very quickly. They appeared to target Muslim and Han Chinese individuals and businesses first but many Tibetans were also caught in the crossfire.
…
This video from Michael from Italy is an excellent example:
http://rapidshare.de/files/38832674/MVI_0483.AVI.html
…
This motorcyclist, who I assume the protesters identified as Han Chinese, was simply riding up Beijing Street when the video took place. He was not army, not police, not doing anything other than riding his motorcycle.
2. On Dalai Lama:
http://shetterly.wordpress.com/2008/03/15/six-surprising-facts-about-the-dalai-lama/#comment-13527
“He is not a pacifist. Though the CIA-supported rebels in Tibet began fighting in the mid-1950s, he did not tell them to stop until 1974, after the CIA cut off their funding. As recently as 2005, he said, “The Iraq war—it’s too early to say, right or wrong.”
…
“He has lied about Tibet under the Dalai Lamas. Though 95 percent of the people were slaves owned by monasteries and nobles, he claimed, “the pervasive influence of Buddhism amid the wide open spaces of an unspoiled environment resulted in a society dedicated to peace and harmony. We enjoyed freedom and contentment.”
3. According to Shakespeare’s Henry IV: Chinese attitude:
“Shall our coffers, then,
Be emptied to redeem a traitor home?
Shall we buy treason? and indent with fears
When they have lost and forfeited themselves?
No, on the barren mountains let him starve!
For I shall never hold that man my friend
Whose tongue shall ask me for one penny cost
To ransom home revolted “Dalai Lama”. ”
Isha
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Shakespeare’s Henry IV is a “respectable Western eyewitnesses”?
WOW, I’m speachless.
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Rodrigo:
Please take some time to read this and consider my Henry IV quote:
http://newschecker.blogspot.com/2008/03/who-lie-about-xizang-tibet-violence-and.html
To the whole class of masters of the media manipulation I am beyond speechless.
Isha
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Isha,
What you seem to fail to understand is that Henry IV was not a “respectable” character. He was a usurper who created political discord and rebellion. If that is the best you can do, it is a rather pathetic historical-literary ally.
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Sam:
First, I enjoy your post on the “Calligraphy at the Met”. Thank you.
Second: I agree with you that Henry IV was a usurper. (Isn’t your current emperor one, too?) I used the word “respectable “(the best the west can provide) in a comparative sense. Henry IV is respectable in a sense he is at least honest to himself and that is far better than the hypocritical forever-lying self righteous mainstream media.
Third, in a large sense, the establishing (H.IV, Washington, Mao) and consolidating (H.V. Teng, Lincoln) of a new country can’t afforded to be completely blameless. Political discord and rebellion will be there. China is in the process of consolidation. In the time of Henry V, at least the Welsh were proud to be part of the state, if not all Irish people. China is getting there.
Interesting bankers love failed states (they can play them at their will for monetary return , think about Indonesia in 1997) and they hate the functioning states with a vengeance, with good reasons.
Isha
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Wales? So, if that is the model then shouldn’t the PRC be willing to create a National Assembly of Tibet, akin to the National Assembly of Wales that was created in 1998? Ireland? You really don’t want to go there as a historical analogy, do you?
I do not buy any of this historical rationalization. China is not “consolidating,” it is a fully sovereign state of considerable power. The only question is why the government there cannot find a better way to treat Tibetans. All else is simply avoiding the PRC government’s responsibility for the failures of its Tibet policy.
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1.
There is still hope for communication: the only objective reporting from the western media so far:
http://www.cnn.com/2008/WORLD/asiapcf/03/20/tibet.miles.interview/
“What I saw was calculated targeted violence against an ethnic group, or I should say two ethnic groups, primarily ethnic Han Chinese living in Lhasa, but also members of the Muslim Hui minority in Lhasa”
2. The Western obession with Tibet has never failed to amaze me until I read this piece:
“The obssesion with Tibet in the West started in the early 20 century by a handful of pot-smoking yippies and has since morphosed into something more atrocious: Heinrich Himmler, the Reich Adiminstrator of notorous SS that was responsible for murduring six millions of European Jews, believed the Tibetans were the high priests of the Aryan race and Jews and Slavs were at the bottom of nazi racial totem pole (by the way, contrary to the public myth, nazis were and still are pagans). The interest in Tibet as long-lost Atlantis (a.k.a nation of Aryans) has not died off after the demise of the Third Reich. In fact, the ruling elite in the West now picked up the mantle of nazis and camouflaged with the pretense of concerning “unique culture and religion.” The failed revisionist movie spouted from the Hollywood “seven days of Tibet” intentionally left out the fact the main charactor was a devout Nazi and was on a secret mission from Heinrich Himmler and his S.S. organization (see History Channel, “Nazi Ocult”).
No wonder Dalai 14th have so many Nazi and Hollywood supporters…
Isha
P.S. On Wales: Why didn’t Brits didn’t do it 200 years before and had to wait for many years after downfall of the empire? I don’t think Chinese have any interest in following the model of a morally and physically bankrupted camp follower…
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Why did Tibetans riot on the 14th and 15th? What happened on the 10th, 11th, 12th and 13th? Miles states that there is no evidence of effective organization, and no evidence of guidance by the Dalai Lama. What is life like for Tibetans in Tibet that might lead them to such desperate acts? What are their economic circumstances? What kinds of restrictions have been placed on their religion? And what happened to their Panchen Lama?
I do not expect you to answer these questions. I simply pose them here as a reminder of the broader context. Indeed, I would prefer it if you did not answer these questions, because I strongly suspect that you will simply spout the Party line. So, spare us the nationalist cant, we can all recite it already (CIA, Dalai Lama, Tibetan landlords, Nazis, etc., etc.)….
I agree with the Dalai Lama: violence of all sorts is unacceptable. But we are left with the question of why some Tibetans turned to violence….
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Being a non-ethnic Han Chinese, I can testify that while there are ethnic prejudices still in China, there is nothing comparing with the intensity of racism here … After thousand year’s interaction, Tibet and Tibetans are still there. After barely three hundreds years, where is original inhabitians of North Americans? where is thier cultures? where is their lanuages? where are their physical beings? … who is more civilized? isn’t it clear?
Dalai Lama’s demand is basically a ethnic cleansing policy and his followers and supporters were practicing it in Lasha. … burning down mosques and burning muslim shops because they are prosperous in business… but they have been there for at least several centuries, long before PRC… such is non-violence of Dalai Lama… He didn’t think it is “unacceptable” to play a god-king, he didn’t think it is “unacceptable” to keep 95% as slaves… he didn’t think sending CIA supported fighters to kill Chinese as ” unacceptable” until the 1970s…
Can one be more Hollywoodish?
Isha
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What is life like for Tibetans in Tibet that might lead them to such desperate acts? What are their economic circumstances?
( Is this guy Berzin, a commie, why he is toeing the party line?)
http://www.berzinarchives.com/web/en/archives/study/islam/modern_interaction/relation_hui_muslims_tibet_uighurs.html
… Here is a piece by an American professor, a student of Tibetian buddism, written well before this incident:
“Contrast between the Tibetan and Hui Mentalities
Many Tibetans still have a nomadic mentality, with a fierce desire for independence, especially freedom of movement. In general, they dislike routine work. Even if they have shops, many will run them only seasonally, frequently closing them for long holidays, pilgrimages, picnics, and so on. Even in India, many Tibetans seasonally migrate to the Indian cities to sell sweaters, go on pilgrimage, attend Buddhist discourses, and only work part of the year. By contrast, the Hui, as well as the Han, are interested only in money and business, and they stay put in their shops and street stalls from 6 AM to 10 PM year-round without moving.
The Hui, being very ingenious as well as industrious, have taken over the manufacture and sale of traditional Tibetan goods, and the Tibetans cannot, and do not even seem to want to compete. The Hui are making Tibetan-style jewelry, rosaries, and other religious paraphernalia, equipment for horses, knives, wool, carpets, musical instruments, shoes and noodles, as well as running the ubiquitous restaurants. The Han merchants come only later and sell mostly modern Chinese manufactured goods like toothbrushes and cheap Chinese clothing.”… As a result of their business successes, their mosque has to be burned down… how peaceful and tolerent one could be…
Isha
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This guy, Peter Hessler, must be a commie, too, since he is explaining that the most hated and vitimized migrant workers by the Tibetan mobs, hardly enjoy any economic advantages, they just worked harder…
“And the Chinese solution to the Tibet question — throwing money at the problem”… is that bad comparing with the recent and current American history toward Indians?…
http://www.theatlantic.com/issues/99feb/tibet3.htm
Isha
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Is this guy a card bearing, party due paying commie that are spouting Party line, even worse, is he a closet “Chinese” nationalist that doesn’t even need to be be refuted?
http://www.michaelparenti.org/Tibet.html
ON the peaceful nature of Dalai Lama:
”
Many Tibetan commandos and agents whom the CIA dropped into the country were chiefs of aristocratic clans or the sons of chiefs. Ninety percent of them were never heard from again, according to a report from the CIA itself, meaning they were most likely captured and killed.29 “Many lamas and lay members of the elite and much of the Tibetan army joined the uprising, but in the main the populace did not, assuring its failure,” writes Hugh Deane.30 In their book on Tibet, Ginsburg and Mathos reach a similar conclusion: “As far as can be ascertained, the great bulk of the common people of Lhasa and of the adjoining countryside failed to join in the fighting against the Chinese both when it first began and as it progressed.”31 Eventually the resistance crumbled.”
Is it a historical fact or a fabicated lie?… or fact doesn’t matter only ideology and self-righteousness?
Isha
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“In 1937, another visitor, Spencer Chapman, wrote, “The Lamaist monk does not spend his time in ministering to the people or educating them. . . . The beggar beside the road is nothing to the monk. Knowledge is the jealously guarded prerogative of the monasteries and is used to increase their influence and wealth.”24 As much as we might wish otherwise, feudal theocratic Tibet was a far cry from the romanticized Shangri La so enthusiastically nurtured by Buddhism’s western proselytes. ”
…
is Spencer Chapman also spouting Party Line back in the 1937?
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Must be CCP’s line:
http://www.state.gov/www/about_state/history/vol_xxx/337_343.html
”
1. Summary–The CIA Tibetan Activity consists of political action, propaganda, and paramilitary activity. The purpose of the program at this stage is to keep the political concept of an autonomous Tibet alive within Tibet and among foreign nations, principally India, and to build a capability for resistance against possible political developments inside Communist China.”
…
The cost of the Tibetan Program for FY 1964 can be summarized in approximate figures as follows:
a. Support of 2100 Tibetan guerrillas based in Nepal–$ 500,000
b. Subsidy to the Dalai Lama–$ 180,000
c. [1 line of source text not declassified] (equipment, transportation, installation, and operator training costs)–$ 225,000
d. Expenses of covert training site in Colorado–$ 400,000
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Your cherry-picking of only that information that supports your own biases confirms my suspicion. The kind of thinking you display here will only serve to perpetuate the problems. Repression will work for a while, but it will create its own backlash and on and on it will go. Without reasoned engagement and an attempt at genuine understanding, no real progress will occur. It’s your problem, Isha, not mine, and you will reap the violent whirlwind that unthinking nationalism creates. And that is all. I am closing comments to this post because nothing productive is possible in this exchange. Goodbye.
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